What a Shocker! Also, question on D'Marques Tyson

by goldhelmet Sat Mar 07, 2015 2:35 pm

What a breakthrough win for the Pilots! This is potentially a program defining/changing moment if they can win another game or two.

On Tyson, I'm wondering why he hasn't played more this year? The times I've seen him play, which are far and few between, he adds an element that I've felt this team has been sorely lacking in some of their losses that could have been wins. In those games, it seemed that long offensive lulls without scoring killed Portland, a lot more than their play on the defensive end, which is typically pretty good. Especially with the horrific shooting from Bobby Sharp this year - who was counted on to hit a few 3's and stretch the defense - lack of consistent shooting/scoring was a big issue.

I'm not trying to say Reveno doesn't have good reasons for not playing Tyson more, because I'm not at practice. It's just been puzzling to me. Is he a liability on the defensive end, or is there some other reason that those who have more of an inside view of the program know about that would explain why he has played so little? At first glance, he appears to to be a guy who should be in the short rotation.

Great win!!! I would assume we're rooting for Santa Clara to beat BYU, but they are also playing very well right now. Who do we match up better with - BYU or SCU?

by Geezaldinho Sat Mar 07, 2015 2:48 pm

His issue was that he has never had to play defense before. We have won games this year when we held teams to low scoring. Today SMC shot 30%.

He has come miles from the start of the season.

Don't forget we got 14 from Todd today.

I expect great things from him.

I expect you are right in rooting for SCU, but don't count on it. BYU trounced them twice.

by goldhelmet Sat Mar 07, 2015 3:32 pm

I figured it was probably an issue on defense, which is very common for young players.

It does seem to me, however, that we have lost more games due to long scoring droughts than we have due to defensive issues.

Jason Todd - I completely agree - is a player that has a bright future for the Pilots going forward.

by DoubleDipper Sat Mar 07, 2015 7:18 pm

Hate to be the contrarian on such a happy day for Pilots fans everywhere, but for anyone who has been paying attention to UP basketball and knows about the injuries and illnesses that have beset the team this season, this game was NOT a shocker, but it was one of the few times they've strung it together for 40 minutes.

Re: Tyson. It has literally been in just the last two weeks that he has understood the schemes at both ends of the floor enough to get more playing time. Bobby is the more complete player, but based upon today's performance, it's a good bet D'Marques will be coming off the bench a lot sooner, and it's also a good bet opposing teams now know who #5 is.

by goldhelmet Sat Mar 07, 2015 9:21 pm

Well, it was pretty unexpected..whatever word you want to use. Put it this way, when is the last time the Pilots have beat a team 3 seeds higher than them in the WCC tournament, let alone how many times have they gotten out of the first round unless it was a win over someone like LMU/Pepperdine when they were perpetual cellar dwellers?

What injuries, other than Riley Barker, who they've now been playing without since early January, have kept out their main rotation players? Every team deals with illnesses and injuries, and I don't think that really explains today. Playing a complete game - especially where they did not have long scoring droughts - bingo, you hit the nail on the head there.

Regarding Tyson, I figured it was something along the defensive end of the floor. Schemes being too complex? If that's the case, the coaches aren't doing a very good job of finding a role for Tyson. When a kid can shoot like that, well, basketball is not nearly as complex as football where understanding the offense or defense would keep you off the field/court. I just find that hard to believe. If he's a liability on defense, which I suspect is the case, that's probably more likely what's keeping him off the court than the schemes.

How is Sharp a "more complete" player? I wouldn't exactly call him a stopper on the defensive end, and for someone who is supposed to be a pure shooter, he has shot 30% from the floor for the season. I realize the majority of those are 3-pointers, but still, he's had WIDE OPEN looks - REPEATEDLY over the course of the season. I would submit, again, that offensive production - from game to game and within each game - has been a much bigger issue for this team in games they could have/should have won than defense. Have we really seen enough of Tyson to know how complete or incomplete of a player he is?

by Geezaldinho Sat Mar 07, 2015 9:53 pm

goldhelmet wrote:
Put it this way, when is the last time the Pilots have beat a team 3 seeds higher than them in the WCC tournament, ?

I'd have to call that the year we beat Gonzaga for the championship.

What injuries, other than Riley Barker, who they've now been playing without since early January, have kept out their main rotation players?

Bailey, Pressley, Gerun, and Thomas have all been hurt or I'll for stretches. Today at thebpregame coach Wolf wasn't sure if Gerun would play (Flu).

Every team deals with illnesses and injuries, and I don't think that really explains today. Playing a complete game - especially where they did not have long scoring droughts - bingo, you hit the nail on the head there.

and it helps if you have a consistent rotation so people know their roles and the people around them.

Regarding Tyson, I figured it was something along the defensive end of the floor. Schemes being too complex?

We beat smc by holding them to 30% shooting. I think the defence was as complex as it needed to be.

As to Sharp, he is a threat at both ends and playes pretty good defence. How well did their guards shoot today?

have we seen enough of Tyson to see how complete or incomplete of a player he is?

There wasn't much mystery at the beginning of the season. Maybe different now.

by goldhelmet Sat Mar 07, 2015 10:36 pm

Geezaldinho wrote:
goldhelmet wrote:
Put it this way, when is the last time the Pilots have beat a team 3 seeds higher than them in the WCC tournament, ?

I'd have to call that the year we beat Gonzaga for the championship.

My point exactly. That was the 95-96 team - 19 years ago. You have to go back that far, and that was a much better Pilot team than this group.

What injuries, other than Riley Barker, who they've now been playing without since early January, have kept out their main rotation players?

Bailey, Pressley, Gerun, and Thomas have all been hurt or I'll for stretches. Today at thebpregame coach Wolf wasn't sure if Gerun would play (Flu).

Again, go back and look at the stats for games played this year during the WCC season. Guys being banged up or sick at various time during the year is all pretty typical. Other than Barker, the Pilots have pretty much been at full strength the entire WCC season.

Every team deals with illnesses and injuries, and I don't think that really explains today. Playing a complete game - especially where they did not have long scoring droughts - bingo, you hit the nail on the head there.
and it helps if you have a consistent rotation so people know their roles and the people around them. Agreed. But if someone is not playing well - consistently - you have to make adjustments sometimes.

Regarding Tyson, I figured it was something along the defensive end of the floor. Schemes being too complex?

We beat smc by holding them to 30% shooting. I think the defence was as complex as it needed to be.

My reference to the schemes had nothing to do with today's game. I was responding to the claim made by DD (see above) that it wasn't until recently that Tyson understood the schemes, therefore one of the reasons he wasn't seeing much PT. My point was that A) basketball is not that complex compared to football - not even close - and schemes are not a typical reason a freshman doesn't play - it's usually defense, and B) that if the coaches can't find a consistent 12-15 minutes for a guy who can clearly shoot because of schematics, then that really says more about them than the player. I am guessing that this has more to do with his defense than anything, which is very common for younger players. But to compare him to Sharp, and say Sharp is a "more complete payer" - more complete in what sense was the question I was posing to you. Especially when his forte is supposed to be shooting and stretching a defense, and he hasn't even been doing that, well, that's a pretty questionable argument.

As to Sharp, he is a threat at both ends and playes pretty good defence. How well did their guards shoot today?

I already addressed this. The stats and the video tape do not lie. 30.6% from the floor - yes most have been three pointers, but they have been WIDE OPEN looks. Sharp is an average defender at best.

have we seen enough of Tyson to see how incomplete of a player he is?

There wasn't much mystery at the beginning of the season. Maybe different now.

There wasn't much mystery at the beginning of the season? Based on what? He hadn't even had a chance to prove himself yet.

by Geezaldinho Sun Mar 08, 2015 9:40 am

goldhelmet wrote:
have we seen enough of Tyson to see how incomplete of a player he is?

Geezaldinho wrote:There wasn't much mystery at the beginning of the season. Maybe different now.

goldhelmet wrote:There wasn't much mystery at the beginning of the season? Based on what? He hadn't even had a chance to prove himself yet.

Well, based on this:

https://www.pilotnation.net/t5479p30-2014-pre-season#61635

He was unnamed by me, not Rev, And he has come a long way since then.

They held Waldo to 8 field goals (1 goal above .500) which was pretty respectable considering what he has been doing to the league. He had to work for his points.
And they didn't just double him all the time and he was unable to get the rest of the team into the offense like he normally does from left post. They held the entire rest of the team to 5 field goals. That wasn't just an accident. Coach Wolfe said in the pregame that was their aim. I don't know how it looked on TV, but live it sure looked like great swarming team defense.

by Dean Murdoch Mon Mar 09, 2015 9:08 am

Geezaldinho wrote:They held the entire rest of the team to 5 field goals.

That is ridiculous...I didn't believe you, so I actually looked it up. Carter 2, Hermanson/Naar/Bright with one each. Incredible stat.

What a Shocker! Also, question on D'Marques Tyson

What a Shocker! Also, question on D'Marques Tyson

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Re: What a Shocker! Also, question on D'Marques Tyson

Re: What a Shocker! Also, question on D'Marques Tyson

Re: What a Shocker! Also, question on D'Marques Tyson

Re: What a Shocker! Also, question on D'Marques Tyson

Re: What a Shocker! Also, question on D'Marques Tyson

Re: What a Shocker! Also, question on D'Marques Tyson

Re: What a Shocker! Also, question on D'Marques Tyson